Help me figure this out (just for fun)

[Fidelis]

edit: I didn't post this in the scenarios section because I'm not an EMT and I don't think this is really the kind of thing that belongs in the scenarios forum. If I'm wrong, I apologize in advance

On another forum, someone posted a video of a college student chugging half a bottle of Everclear. There was some discussion about whether the student survived the incident, so I tried to figure out what the chances are that someone could survive doing something that stupid. I have no medical training, but I'm on this forum to learn about EMS and I've applied to an EMT-B rookie school with a local EMS provider. I wanted to run my reasoning by you guys to see if it was sound and to see what you guys could add to the discussion. I'm curious to see if I'm anywhere close to being right. A potential problem I see is my assumption about the absorption rate of alcohol into the bloodstream. Here's my argument:

We can figure out whether he was likely to die by considering the average volume of blood in an adult male (5 L or 5000 mL) and the amount of alcohol he consumed at one time (half a bottle, so 375 mL of 190 proof alcohol, or about 350 mL of pure alcohol).

We can assume that the alcohol would be absorbed into his bloodstream fairly quickly, at least within an hour, but my guess is that it would be much faster. His liver would not be able to remove much alcohol within the first hour, so I'm going to ignore it for simplicity.

If my reasoning is correct, his BAL would be around 7%.

350 mL divided by 5000 mL = 0.07

If I'm right, he could have very, very easily died, because the LD50 of alcohol is 0.40%, meaning that half of people with BAL of 0.40% will die. 7%? Forget about it, he's dead unless he gets IMMEDIATE medical assistance, and even then that might not work.

Here is the video:

[youtube]On_m3V7ZMtE[/youtube]

 

[Hastings]

Yeah, he could have died.

Or he could have lived.

Ooh, a mystery!



Really though, since the chances of living aren't 100% and the chances of dying aren't 100%, there's no way to really calculate what the result was.

My guess? Probably lived. People like that always live.

Also, internet videos. Might not even be what they appear to be.

 

[Fidelis]

Yeah, he could have died.

Or he could have lived.

Ooh, a mystery!



Really though, since the chances of living aren't 100% and the chances of dying aren't 100%, there's no way to really calculate what the result was.

My guess? Probably lived. People like that always live.

Also, internet videos. Might not even be what they appear to be.

Obviously there is no way to know for certain what happened to him without having more information, but my reason for posting this thread was to generate discussion about the likely outcome based on what we do know about the situation (assuming that the video is real, otherwise it's no fun). That he could have either lived or died goes without saying--that's not the kind of response I was looking for. I'm looking for analysis.

 

[Hastings]

Oh, analysis?

1. Alcohol poisoning is a very real thing.

2. There is nothing attractive, intelligent, or fun about drinking yourself stupid.

3. Darwinism doesn't seem to exist when alcohol is involved. Often, those who drink too much alcohol survive, and those that choose intelligently not to drink or to drink responsibly are the ones that end up dead. Usually by the former.

 

[Buzz]

My guess? Probably lived. People like that always live.

That does seem to be the case. I'd have figured he'd have thrown up not too long after drinking that, but I guess his stomach is/was far stronger than mine.

I find that discussion they are having at the end interesting. The reluctance to take someone to the hospital is all too common. Not that I would ever drink enough to get myself into that condition, but I would be quite pissed if my friends ever made a similar decision like that regarding me.

 

[mikeylikesit]

depends on how much he regularly drinks. if he drinks a ton all the time than a BAC of .4 would not even make him vomit. BTW LD50 is usually .5 but has been able to reach as high as .7. any rate it would depend if there really was everclear in the bottle or if it was just water and a stunt fro the camera. too many different factors to say for sure either way.

 

[KEVD18]

he very well might have died. he surely killed many a brain cells doing a stupid and childish stunt, if he did in fact drink that much everclear all at once(a fact that im not convinced of btw).

 

[Jon]

he very well might have died. he surely killed many a brain cells doing a stupid and childish stunt, if he did in fact drink that much everclear all at once(a fact that im not convinced of btw).

Kev,

Are you and I going to agree here?

I say that water also looks pretty clear... and would be easy to chug... as a stunt to impress people or just to be retarded and think it was cool.

Or, he could have drunk it and then had a little time praying to the porcelain g-d.

 

[KEVD18]

well i'll be damned...

 

[BossyCow]

I'm going to say the likelihood of that amount of alcohol remaining in the stomach long enough to enter the bloodstream is pretty low. I've seen some pretty impressive blood alcohol levels but they take quite a training program and a lot of dedication on the part of the pt to develop that kind of tolerance. You have to be willing to put time in on an intense program of continual alcohol consumption to reach that level of professionalism.

But, its a home-made video and who knows how watered down the stuff was before he 'chugged' it.

 

[CFRBryan347768]

Listen closely you hear it open. I would not doubt these kids doin it; heck I have seen some of my friends try.

 

[shannon williams]

That is a very sad video, if it is real, I feel very badly for that kid's family.

 

[KEVD18]

Listen closely you hear it open. I would not doubt these kids doin it; heck I have seen some of my friends try.

sure you do. but that doesnt mean it was the first time it was opened, just the first time the seal was broken. i can get a cap off a bottle without breaking the seal, alter or exchange the contents and replace the cap without anybody being the wiser.

i dont doubt that this would be attempted. ive seen this type of stunt before. hell back in the day ive been part of similar stunts. the question at hand, at least originally, was whether or not somebody doing this would live.

 

[Fidelis]

Regarding it being fake: he dips his finger in the bottle and lights it, so it's obviously a high proof liquor.

There's actually another video on youtube of another guy doing the same thing on a $200 bet, and at the end of the video it says he dies. I'm not sure if I believe that video, though, because it shows the guy stumbling to his bedroom and falling down, and then his friend immediately runs over and says he's not breathing.

Anyway, the main thing I was curious about is whether you guys think someone could hold the liqour long enough to raise their BAC to fatal levels. I guess the consensus is "maybe".

 

[MMiz]

Two words: JOB SECURITY

 

[KEVD18]

bac is a toughie. there are too many variables to actually nail down an answer. body mass index, last oral intake(and its makeup), length of time overwhich the etoh was consumed etc.

 

[emtc9019]

bal

i am from rhode island an we just had a guy that crashed his car and had a bal of.491 and walked away so anything is possible if the person is used to having a high level in there system

 

[mperkel]

that video was definitely faked, it was watered down for sure. He wouldn't be able to down it so fast and so smoothly without gagging. He also took 2 more sips after. It's just not possible to do that much. PLus if it were true, he'd surely be dead.