Do you feel that your gender has influenced your experience as an EMS provider?

[Kevinf]

At my company, the only time anyone cares about gender is for bariatric situations.

Our female EMTs are fine as long as they get assigned to a kneeling ambulance. But if they end up on a non-kneeler, everyone in dispatch regards that unit as inferior. As a result, that unit gets dispatched wherever possible in order to keep the superior units (bariatric capable, ALS, etc.) in reserve for ER calls.

So, from the female EMT's point of view, being assigned to a non-kneeling ambulance means running more calls per day than average.

I don't know what a kneeling ambulance is, care to elaborate?

 

[chaz90]

I don't know what a kneeling ambulance is, care to elaborate?

Air ride suspension that lowers itself down when loading/unloading. The rest of the post was pretty much unadulterated sexism.

 

[lwems]

Air ride suspension that lowers itself down when loading/unloading. The rest of the post was pretty much unadulterated sexism.

Now look what you've done. You whipped out the moral condemnation, and shut down the conversation.

You got to have the feeling of virtuousness, yeah, but the rest of us are now unable to discuss an actual real-world problem affecting female EMTs. We have to go back to work today and pretend the problem does not exist.

 

[chaz90]

If I were going for moral indignation you would know it.

The problem doesn't exist in the general terms you seem to mention. If a service is hiring people that aren't able to perform the lifting functions of their job it is an HR problem. Any provider on an ambulance should be able to function with their assigned crew to handle the majority of calls they are given. Bariatric calls should always be handled with additional resources as necessary, regardless of the genders of the initially assigned crew.

Thousands of all female EMS units across the world handle calls every day without being regarded as "inferior" by their dispatchers or co-workers. If this is how it works in your system, adjustments are needed to hiring practices, fitness evaluations, and possibly equipment needs. Furthermore, a pervasive belief of the inferiority of some of your crews that is reflected in dispatching and operations needs to be handled sooner rather than later.

 

[lwems]

If I were going for moral indignation you would know it.

The problem doesn't exist in the general terms you seem to mention. If a service is hiring people that aren't able to perform the lifting functions of their job it is an HR problem. Any provider on an ambulance should be able to function with their assigned crew to handle the majority of calls they are given. Bariatric calls should always be handled with additional resources as necessary, regardless of the genders of the initially assigned crew.

Thousands of all female EMS units across the world handle calls every day without being regarded as "inferior" by their dispatchers or co-workers. If this is how it works in your system, adjustments are needed to hiring practices, fitness evaluations, and possibly equipment needs. Furthermore, a pervasive belief of the inferiority of some of your crews that is reflected in dispatching and operations needs to be handled sooner rather than later.

It is not honest to insist we regard a bariatric-capable crew as equal to a crew that requires a lift-assist. No matter what words you choose, a crew that needs list-assist is less useful to dispatch, more expensive for the company, and less safe for the patient.

Saying "change your hiring practices" just means: don't hire slight females. Okay, fine, I won't. But that is a much worse outcome for the slight female.

If you'll recall, the point of this thread was to consider whether females have an equal footing in EMS. You'd prefer we dress up the word "inferior crew" in prettier terms like "excluded by PT evaluation", alright, I can do that. Here goes:

"The crew on M3 is requiring two lift assists per day, causing delays to ripple through the system... we need to adjust our PT evaluation for future hirings."

Everyone is equal, but some are less equal.

 

[Tigger]

Actually a crew that uses a lift assist is far safer for the patient. It's the crews that think that that they can do every transport without help that place the patient in danger. How do you figure out you can't lift the patient? When you drop them. I'd much rather a crew use lift assists more frequently and place the patients safety ahead of the bottom line, it's absurd to think otherwise.

 

[Handsome Robb]

Actually a crew that uses a lift assist is far safer for the patient. It's the crews that think that that they can do every transport without help that place the patient in danger. How do you figure out you can't lift the patient? When you drop them. I'd much rather a crew use lift assists more frequently and place the patients safety ahead of the bottom line, it's absurd to think otherwise.

Not to mention your own safety. I know you know but a back or shoulder injury sucks. Combine them and it really blows.

 

[lwems]

Actually a crew that uses a lift assist is far safer for the patient. It's the crews that think that that they can do every transport without help that place the patient in danger. How do you figure out you can't lift the patient? When you drop them. I'd much rather a crew use lift assists more frequently and place the patients safety ahead of the bottom line, it's absurd to think otherwise.

Our industry doesn't work that way. Try calling for lift assist more often than, say, twice a week, and see what happens.

But that's not the point. The point is: at what weight does a crew need to call lift assist in order to keep the risk of injury below (say) 0.2%?

A typical burly male crew can handle up to perhaps 300 pounds without the risk rising above the threshold. A crew containing a slight female will see the risk begin rising at perhaps 250 pounds.

The lower weight threshold equals more lift assists -> more delays -> more units needed in the field -> more costs -> lower pay and/or less hiring for females.

 

[Tigger]

Our industry doesn't work that way. Try calling for lift assist more often than, say, twice a week, and see what happens.

But that's not the point. The point is: at what weight does a crew need to call lift assist in order to keep the risk of injury below (say) 0.2%?

A typical burly male crew can handle up to perhaps 300 pounds without the risk rising above the threshold. A crew containing a slight female will see the risk begin rising at perhaps 250 pounds.

The lower weight threshold equals more lift assists -> more delays -> more units needed in the field -> more costs -> lower pay and/or less hiring for females.

I know exactly happens when you do that because I did it all the time at the place I got my start with in Boston. I didn't care that as an all male crew we were expected to do 350 alone. Sure we could, but I had no interest in putting myself or the patient at risk. The weight itself is only one part of the equation, how it's distributed makes a difference too.

No one ever denied my requests and before you knew it our regular bariatric transfers had a lift assist automatically sent and crews saw that they could request them without fear of punishment so long as they did it early.

Having different requirements for crews is asinine and begging for trouble. And as someone with a back injury I was not going to put my health in front of the company's bottom line. I met the minimum requirements at hire and I had no interest in exceeding them since I wasn't going to receive anything more than an attaboy for it. I worked the Bari truck for a while and no one seemed to have an issue.

 

[AtlasFlyer]

We are NEVER chastised or "punished" for requesting lift assistance. On the contrary, we are highly encouraged to utilize our resources and help is given quickly and without question. I would get in far more "trouble" at work for attempting to life more than I should than for asking for help. You can darn well believe I'm going to ask for assistance when necessary to avoid injury to myself, my partner and my patient.

 

[Handsome Robb]

We are NEVER chastised or "punished" for requesting lift assistance. On the contrary, we are highly encouraged to utilize our resources and help is given quickly and without question. I would get in far more "trouble" at work for attempting to life more than I should than for asking for help. You can darn well believe I'm going to ask for assistance when necessary to avoid injury to myself, my partner and my patient.

Agreed.

I find it hard to believe that you work in the industry or have for any length of time to be saying you'll be punished for asking for a lift assist.

For IFT I see how it could potentially pose a problem as far as units. We're a 911 system, all I have to do is request fire if they're not there already, which is rare, and they'll gladly come and help us.

 

[Tigger]

Agreed.

I find it hard to believe that you work in the industry or have for any length of time to be saying you'll be punished for asking for a lift assist.

For IFT I see how it could potentially pose a problem as far as units. We're a 911 system, all I have to do is request fire if they're not there already, which is rare, and they'll gladly come and help us.

If you are punished then a new employer is in order I'd say.

And don't to anyone that responds with "well jobs are how to come by and that's just the reality of the business:" do better. If you let you're employer put your own wellbeing at risk, then I don't know what to say.

 

[mycrofft]

And not only sheer weight, but difficulty of traverse. The crew to move a 300 lb pt down front steps doesn't equate to that needed for an old stairway with a small landing, a residential home's hallway with a bend or two, or on ice or snow.

Need those union safety rules, folks.

But we digress.