Who is your company hiring???

MEDicJohn

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DrParasite

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A good background check? he was convicted of no crimes, nor was he criminally charged with a crime. What would have background check have revealed?

"During Carpio’s employment at Care Medical, which lasted less than two weeks, Carpio's co-workers filed four complaints against him for workplace sexual harassment and assault.

He allegedly made inappropriate comments to female patients and was eventually fired for those comments" OK so he was a crappy employee, and fired for his actions. was any of it criminal? are making inappropriate comments to female patients grounds for revocation of his certification? or simply termination from employment?

Also, he was employed for less than 2 weeks.... did his new employer know anything about this? could or would his former employer have told the prospective employer what happened, and risk a defamation lawsuit from Carpio?

We all know bad pennies that hope around from company to company. pay people poorly, maintain low standards, require a pulse and a patch and as long as billing can process paperwork correctly, they have a job.

Much of what is said is from the attorney, and from the lawsuit; I'll wait and hear the verdict of the case before I say if the companies' messed up, and see how much it changes the industry. after all, right now we only have one side of the lawsuit, and that side is making a lot of assumptions that may not even be accurate.
 
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MEDicJohn

MEDicJohn

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He allegedly made inappropriate comments to female patients and was eventually fired for those comments" OK so he was a crappy employee, and fired for his actions. was any of it criminal? are making inappropriate comments to female patients grounds for revocation of his certification? or simply termination from employment?

I agree completely as a San Diego supervisor i know that you have to report all terminations to SD county EMS office, but what they do with that info or what warrants investigation i have no clue. Now as for communication between employers when someone applies for a position they list prior employment and whether or not they would allow you to communicate with that employer or not. " May we contact". Not saying i know Carpio's application results but if he had checked that box then thats consent. No defamation if you're reporting the facts.
 

DesertMedic66

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I know employers in my area very rarely actually fire anyone. They pull you into the office and say “you have two choices. Either we can fire you and then have to report that to the county EMS office who will do an investigation or you can quit right now and no one will know”. Also several employers in my area have a “no release of information aside from verifying they work/worked here”.
 

DrParasite

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you have to report all terminations to SD county EMS office
all terminations? so any time an EMS employees gets terminated, for any reasons, you notify the county EMS office? what do you tell them? the person's name, EMS ID number, and why they were terminated? do you also provided details to the investigation? do those who voluntarily resign get reported to the EMS office too?

I know San Diego County isn't very small, but with the amount of turnover in EMS, that looks like a full time position just to process all the notices.
Now as for communication between employers when someone applies for a position they list prior employment and whether or not they would allow you to communicate with that employer or not. " May we contact". Not saying i know Carpio's application results but if he had checked that box then thats consent. No defamation if you're reporting the facts.
If I was Carpio (and I'm not, just so we are clear), and i was fired for sexual harassment, after two weeks of employment, I wouldn't even list that on my application for past employers. And if I did put it on, then i wouldn't check that box; only an idiot would be ok with that if they were terminated under those circumstances.

Also, check with your HR department about what they are comfortable having you release to a reference checker: many limit by company policy, to protect against lawsuits, to only start and end dates, and if eligible for rehire.
 
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MEDicJohn

MEDicJohn

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all terminations? so any time an EMS employees gets terminated, for any reasons, you notify the county EMS office? what do you tell them? the person's name, EMS ID number, and why they were terminated? do you also provided details to the investigation? do those who voluntarily resign get reported to the EMS office too?
Yes any termination has to be reported to the county. You tell them the reason for termination (can be vague) and yes name and id number which with the lemsis ( Local EMS Information System) they have everything. On top of reporting this termination they also separate member and agency affiliation. No not required to report voluntary resignations to county only that you remove the affiliation of member and agency in the lemsis system.


If I was Carpio (and I'm not, just so we are clear), and i was fired for sexual harassment, after two weeks of employment, I wouldn't even list that on my application for past employers. And if I did put it on, then i wouldn't check that box; only an idiot would be ok with that if they were terminated under those circumstances.

I would also like to make it clear that I am not Carpio.
 

akflightmedic

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I know employers in my area very rarely actually fire anyone. They pull you into the office and say “you have two choices. Either we can fire you and then have to report that to the county EMS office who will do an investigation or you can quit right now and no one will know”. Also several employers in my area have a “no release of information aside from verifying they work/worked here”.

Wow! I would NEVER voluntarily resign, ever. It releases the employer from financial obligations and YOU from potential benefits when you make it that easy for them. My reply would be, if you want to fire me and have adequate documented reason to do so, then proceed. And I would collect all copies of every piece of written evidence and take notes during the process.

And yes, I myself have been fired several times, and no it has not stopped me from moving on.

As an employer, I have fired employees. I never allowed them the chance to resign. If their offense was so severe it required termination, then termination is what they received. And they too went on to have productive careers afterwards. When I was called for employment verification I gave dates of hire and were they eligible for rehire. I did not elaborate.
 
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akflightmedic

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I too, am NOT Carpio!
 

PotatoMedic

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I'm a potato... 🥔
 

Kevinf

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You are largely at the mercy of the employee to correctly list their prior employers, unless your HR dept is going to call every EMS agency in a 100-mile area every time someone is hired. If you do get a proper list, the most you are likely to get from the former employer is "yes, Joe Shmoe worked here for X period of time and is/is not eligible for re-hire" due to liability concerns. If they don't have an actual criminal record, that isn't overly helpful either.

So you can't keep bad eggs out, and you'll eventually be the first one egged regardless of how intensive the background check and vetting process is. Many co-workers aren't eager to rat out their peers due to potentially being stuck a few feet away from someone for tens of hours who knows you ratted them out. The only thing you can do is monitor everything you can legally put a camera and mic on, which makes for a rather Orwellian workspace... and is extremely cost and labor intensive to store and regularly review.

What's the good answer here? I don't think there is one.

Eventually, someone who's a bad apple gets a known reputation. But even despite our small EMS world, that takes a while as well.
 
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MEDicJohn

MEDicJohn

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So you can't keep bad eggs out, and you'll eventually be the first one egged regardless of how intensive the background check and vetting process is

Yes i totally agree, and unfortunately for these companies it is resulting in large lawsuit. I do also believe that if your supervisors maintain good communication that whole ratting out process isn't a thing. Yes i know the Utopian EMS ideal where the supervisor is able to have real conversations with staff.
 

johnrsemt

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Pay for a background check company; the best and easiest way to find out where someone worked is the SS office (and I don't remember how to do it, it has been too long); but they find out what company has paid John Doe SS taxes and when. So when John Doe puts on his application past jobs that have all closed, they can still be checked.
My old companies had problems though. Hired some real winners over the years working both in Retail and EMS.

Where I work now does a extremely detailed background check. Including a security clearance; it can take over 3 months to get hired for any type of job. So they don't run into this type of thing often I don't think.
 
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