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Transporting of narcs

Discussion in 'BLS Discussion' started by Brittanyemt, Nov 13, 2017.

  1. Brittanyemt

    Brittanyemt Forum Ride Along

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    So I currently work for a bls company. I am assigned to a cct rig. Sometimes, management will have an emt and a nurse starting out of 2 different stations. Meaning, the emt will have to meet the nurse at another station with a fully stocked rig. Including narcotics. I have done some research as far as an emt transporting narcs, but it’s really a grey area. Does anyone happen to know a little more?? TIA!
     
  2. Colt45

    Colt45 Forum Crew Member

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    Your narcs are locked up and tagged so I doubt it would be a huge deal for you to drive the rig to pick up your partner. Obviously administration is limited to BLS for you, but I don' think transport is a huge deal.

    I don't know the exact law and it probably changes with location, but I highly highly doubt this would ever even be an issue for you!
     
    Brittanyemt likes this.
  3. Brittanyemt

    Brittanyemt Forum Ride Along

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  4. Brittanyemt

    Brittanyemt Forum Ride Along

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    Thanks for the reply. I am from ca, and a lot of nurses and emts are very hesitant. Yes they are double locked. But everyone of course, has a different opinion. I also tried looking in my county protocols.. Grey area as well.
     
  5. Colt45

    Colt45 Forum Crew Member

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    Maybe something you could ask administration about? If it' kind of a big thing between your co-workers right now I'm sure management has an answer!
     
    Gurby likes this.
  6. Brittanyemt

    Brittanyemt Forum Ride Along

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    Lol management has no answer. They say just do it. They don’t really care what happens if and when the DEA gets a hold of you. I just hear they would have a field day. More so just knowledge for myself if I ever get caught in this situation. And people come to me, and I don’t have a right answer for them either. Thanks again for you help!
     
  7. VentMonkey

    VentMonkey Crackpot Premium Member

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    You’re seriously worried about transporting sealed narcotics on your company’s time, in a safely, secured, and locked place? Wow.
     
    NomadicMedic likes this.
  8. Brittanyemt

    Brittanyemt Forum Ride Along

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    No one asked for your rude comment. And it was a question. I’m not the one with a problem. I wanted to gather other opinions on this. Sincere opinions.. not rude.
     
  9. VentMonkey

    VentMonkey Crackpot Premium Member

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    That is my opinion, sincerely:).

    Let me ask you this: how do you think those narcotics got to your service in the first place?

    What people do not know is one thing, but just about every service I know of is fed by speculators, and water-cooler opinions. If you cannot find anything after doing your own research except it being a gray area, what does that tell you?

    If there is no policy in play at your particular service, and you’re seriously that concerned, then talk to your administrators about implementing one. In a pinch we have narcs brought to our base by EMT’s when the supes are backed up; safe, locked, and double-sealed.
     
  10. Brittanyemt

    Brittanyemt Forum Ride Along

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    Yes I completely understand what you’re saying. Like I said, I am not the one with the problem. I just constantly hear the same complaint over and over again. So I figured I’d look into it myself, and maybe ask a question or 2. Even admin says it’s jot supposed to happen but does anyway..
     
  11. akflightmedic

    akflightmedic Forum Deputy Chief

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    Methinks the DEA has more pressing concerns such as the "war on drugs" and all the recent legalization all over the country to keep them busy. Far more interesting things out there than them spot checking a random marked ambulance with on duty staff transporting sealed, double locked, minute supply of narcs. Wowsers....I think the issue is stemming more from people trying to find ways to A) be a douche to their employer B) not have to do these shuttle runs (slack in their role) or C) both of the above.
     
    vf116, EpiEMS, hometownmedic5 and 2 others like this.
  12. NomadicMedic

    NomadicMedic formerly DEmedic

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    Why does admin say “it’s not supposed to happen”? Is there a written policy that says an EMT cant transport locked narcs? If not, don’t worry.
     
    EpiEMS and Brittanyemt like this.
  13. hometownmedic5

    hometownmedic5 Forum Captain

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    Keep your hands off the narcotics(really all the medications beyond your scope) and you'll be fine.
     
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  14. Brittanyemt

    Brittanyemt Forum Ride Along

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    Hands are off narcs.. only transporting to and from station. Although without medic or nurse. To me it doesn’t seem like a big deal. I don’t know the code to any of the locks, so therefore it wouldn’t be my problem if I did happen to get stopped on random.
     
  15. NPO

    NPO Forum Deputy Chief

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    Let's think about the other people who transport narcotics:

    Tow truck drivers
    Freight delivery drivers
    Postal carriers
    Ambulance administrators

    There's not a problem with transporting them. Just using them.
     
    vf116, Chase and luke_31 like this.
  16. DrParasite

    DrParasite The fire extinguisher is not just for show

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    She's not the only one, as this questions has been raised at my former place(s) of employment, by both EMTs and Paramedics.
    Considering many agencies explicitly say "EMTs are not allowed to touch the narcs" can you blame them? The medic or nurse has to have them on their possession at all times, etc. So if you tell an EMT "take these narcs and give them to paramedic A" and it runs contrary to the whole "only paramedics can do anything with narcs", these types of questions occur.

    We had an issue where only the paramedic supervisors would replenish used narcs. so if you had a night where only an EMT supervisor was on (we usually ran with 2, but minimum staffing for them was 1), what would you do? Our medical director and agency director made the decision: since supply replenishment is an operational issue, not a clinical issue, you don't need to be a paramedic to replenish narc; any supervisor could do it, provided the same level of documentation was performed. He used the same analogy: the UPS guy isn't a paramedic, and he is delivering the drugs to you..... how is that any different than the non-ALS supervisor giving you a replacement vial?
     
    Colt45, NomadicMedic and Brittanyemt like this.
  17. Tigger

    Tigger Dodges Pucks Community Leader

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    Crap we send wheelchair drivers to the hospital to pick up cases of fentanyl and versed. The narcotics will not spontaneously combust if there isn't a medic/RN nearby. They're locked in safe, should be more than sufficient. I don't think you will find a reference permitting this practice as there isn't really much to permit.
     
  18. Remi

    Remi Forum Deputy Chief Premium Member

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    Generally speaking, there is no problem with a non-RN transporting controlled substances for legitimate purposes. Happens all the time, all over the place, as has been pointed out.

    The short answer is this: if it weren’t permitted, your company would not have you do it. In order to get and keep a DEA CS permit they have to jump through all sorts of hoops surrounding the logistics of purchasing, transporting, storing, and accounting for these drugs. Your agency has a lot more to lose than you personally do if they were knowingly having you break the law.

    I think you can trust your management on this one.
     
    akflightmedic likes this.

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