Impact of 2020 Election on EMS?

MMiz

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Is there any thought as to the impact of the 2020 election on EMS?
 

Tigger

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Directly? I have no idea. We have seen some CMS billing changes in the last few years but I don't really think that has anything to do with the presidency, but rather that it was just time.

It has been interesting to watch from an IAFF prospective. Biden and the IAFF have a long standing relationship which is understandable given the Democrats general support for organized labor. This however has created great discord amongst our local with some leaving the union and others calling for action against the IAFF. Without our local, we would have seen staffing decreases but through a lot of work by the body and direct financial support from the IAFF, we passed a tax increase and are now able to actually meet the needs of the community. Again, this would not have been possible without the IAFF, yet so many of our members are irate about endorsing a democrat. I don't really know what to make of this, I trust that the IAFF will make the political decisions it needs to stay in a position as a very strong labor union. That in turn is good for us?
 

DrParasite

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if Trump wins, it will be 4 more years of "not my president," "whatever Trump's administration does is bad for America" and every bad thing that happens is "all Trump's fault." All of which is a lie. There will also be more protests in the streets, and riots if people don't get what they feel they are entitled to.

If Biden wins, it will be 4 years of higher taxes for pet projects, more lawlessness, businesses will continue to suffer, and big tech will continue to manipulate this country's politics. Actually, that's not true; I doubt he'll last more than 2 years as POTUS before he steps down or gets removed, and VP Harris takes over, which will be an even bigger disaster for this country.

I remember working EMS from 2008 to 2014... and trying to get a job in the corporate world in 2004. Hard to get approval to hire more people, lots of open shifts, voluntary OT not approved, budget cuts, yet the public's expectations were never lowered. So we were expected to perform Grade A+ services with Grade C funding.

I am generally pro-labor and support unions when it comes to EMS. I also know that relying on elected leadership to "do the right thing" is foolish thinking and "take care of their first responders" only last as long as the cameras are rolling. So having that contract is a legally binding way where the city can't arbitrarily make employees pay changes because of poor budgeting. But I agree with many of the union locals, who feel that Biden's administration won't help them out as much as Trump's administration would. I am also smart enough to know that public safety funding is a local issue, so the federal elections have less to do with it than state and local budgets.

The biggest impact from the election that will directly affect EMS will be the economic outcome. If the economy continues to improve, businesses continue to open up and generate tax revenue, and that money can be directed into EMS agencies, it will be good for us. if the economy slows down, businesses are forced to stay closed and lay off staff, and the projected tax revenues continue to fall, I see EMS budgets getting slashed, cities trying to negotiate pay cuts with unions to offset their underwater budgets, and private companies getting shafted even further when cities raise their rates for the right to provide EMS services to their areas.
 

Carlos Danger

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The only immediate ramifications that I can envision are those related to potential widespread civil disturbance, possibly much worse than what we saw over the summer.

Once that dies down, who knows. I doubt it makes much difference to EMS who the president is.
 
OP
MMiz

MMiz

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if Trump wins, it will be 4 more years of "not my president," "whatever Trump's administration does is bad for America" and every bad thing that happens is "all Trump's fault." All of which is a lie. There will also be more protests in the streets, and riots if people don't get what they feel they are entitled to.

I can't find anything in either candidate's platform about EMS, though I was able to read up on Biden's plan for healthcare.

What is Trump's plan for the COVID response, healthcare, and EMS? I ask not because I'm necessarily critical, but because I can't find it.

If Biden wins, it will be 4 years of higher taxes for pet projects, more lawlessness, businesses will continue to suffer, and big tech will continue to manipulate this country's politics. Actually, that's not true; I doubt he'll last more than 2 years as POTUS before he steps down or gets removed, and VP Harris takes over, which will be an even bigger disaster for this country.

Where do you see him raising taxes for those working in EMS? I don't see how the average EMT making $37,000 a year or Paramedic making $44,000 a year will be impacted by Biden's tax plan.

The lawlessness, economy, and issues with big tech are all under Trump's watch, no?

But I agree with many of the union locals, who feel that Biden's administration won't help them out as much as Trump's administration would. I am also smart enough to know that public safety funding is a local issue, so the federal elections have less to do with it than state and local budgets.

I spent some time looking at unions and it looks like it's a mixed bag.

The biggest impact from the election that will directly affect EMS will be the economic outcome. If the economy continues to improve, businesses continue to open up and generate tax revenue, and that money can be directed into EMS agencies, it will be good for us. if the economy slows down, businesses are forced to stay closed and lay off staff, and the projected tax revenues continue to fall, I see EMS budgets getting slashed, cities trying to negotiate pay cuts with unions to offset their underwater budgets, and private companies getting shafted even further when cities raise their rates for the right to provide EMS services to their areas.

I agree that the economic climate, COVID, and a transformation of how healthcare is delivered will have a huge impact on the future on EMS. I just can't figure where the candidates stand.

Biden has documented plans and policy positions, Trump has commented about lowering drug costs and getting rid of the Affordable Care Act.

From my research it seems like no one is quite sure the implications of the presidential election on EMS. Just wanted to make sure I wasn't missing anything.
 

mgr22

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The only immediate ramifications that I can envision are those related to potential widespread civil disturbance, possibly much worse than what we saw over the summer.

Once that dies down, who knows. I doubt it makes much difference to EMS who the president is.

I agree, and would just add that I think the degree of civil disturbance would be exacerbated by a close election and muted by a landslide, in either direction.
 

DrParasite

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I can't find anything in either candidate's platform about EMS, though I was able to read up on Biden's plan for healthcare.

What is Trump's plan for the COVID response, healthcare, and EMS? I ask not because I'm necessarily critical, but because I can't find it.
Where did you look? because I found these all pretty quickly.

What's Biden's plan on covid, other than to do exactly what Trump is doing (listening to the scientists, get a vaccine completed and distributed), and keeping the US shut down until COVID is under control?
Where do you see him raising taxes for those working in EMS? I don't see how the average EMT making $37,000 a year or Paramedic making $44,000 a year will be impacted by Biden's tax plan.
I don't see him focusing on the underpaid EMS workers, but I don't believe for a second he is only going to raise taxes on those making more than 400k a year. And it seems many people who are smarter and more understanding of the tax codes think the same:

Under Biden’s proposed plans, there would in fact be a need for across the board tax increases. Analysis of Biden’s plans by the Tax Foundation, American Enterprise Institute (AEI), Tax Policy Center, Committee for a Responsible Federal Budget (CRFB), and Wharton Business School have all come to the same conclusion: Biden’s plans will increase taxes across the board.
The lawlessness, economy, and issues with big tech are all under Trump's watch, no?
That is a very valid statement, however it doesn't take into account the 10th amendment to the constitution, the pandemic, and the fact that many in big tech and the media (and I'm including the satire news too) lean heavily to the left.

For lawlessness, the president can only do so much, if the governors and mayors won't allow law enforcement to do their job (look at Philly, Chicago, Washington DC, Portland, NYC, and the Seattle CHOP zone for examples). POTUS can't just go in and fix their issues, because it's a local issue, and otherwise he would be seen as a dictator (btw, the 10th amendment says "Each state retains its sovereignty, freedom, and independence, and every power, jurisdiction, and right, which is not by this Confederation expressly delegated to the United States, in Congress assembled")

For the economy, things were booming, until the pandemic hit, and while I think we all agree that the POTUS is powerful, he isn't responsible for a global pandemic. Further, much of the economic issues resulted in everything shutting down, with business closing, layoffs happening, etc. Trump wants to reopen the economy, while Biden wants to keep it shut down (see previous link). Multiple credible sources said the economy improved significantly under Trump, due to his policies, according to https://markets.businessinsider.com...-bush-administrations-2019-9-1028833119?op=1#

Did he oversell it? probably, but it's his salesman nature to overhype stuff.

And Big tech's bias are manipulating the 2020 election. it's tough to blame one person for an industries biases. Esp with the Senate judiciary committee investigating (remember, the legislative branch just makes the laws, the executive branch just enforces them)
I spent some time looking at unions and it looks like it's a mixed bag.
Sure, it's def a mixed bag... the IAFF endorsed biden, but many locals endorsed trump
I agree that the economic climate, COVID, and a transformation of how healthcare is delivered will have a huge impact on the future on EMS. I just can't figure where the candidates stand.

Biden has documented plans and policy positions, Trump has commented about lowering drug costs and getting rid of the Affordable Care Act.

From my research, it seems like no one is quite sure the implications of the presidential election on EMS. Just wanted to make sure I wasn't missing anything.
Don't forget, Biden changes plans and policy positions all the time, depending on who he is speaking to and what is popular at any given time with his base https://2020election.procon.org/view.resource.php?resourceID=007076

I think EMS is such a small entity (overall, compared to oil, teachers, law enforcement, hospitals, etc) that we are more affected indirectly by the election than directly. Personally, I like having more money in my paycheck now, like having a bigger tax refund, and think once operation warp speed concludes, things will again be looking good for every American citizen.
 

SandpitMedic

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FYI- raising taxes on the “rich” and “big business” will still effect those downstream. Any basic economics course can teach you that.
 

mgr22

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I think EMS is such a small entity (overall, compared to oil, teachers, law enforcement, hospitals, etc) that we are more affected indirectly by the election than directly. Personally, I like having more money in my paycheck now, like having a bigger tax refund, and think once operation warp speed concludes, things will again be looking good for every American citizen.

I agree with the first sentence. As for the second, let me share the perspective of an old, retired guy with no paycheck. There are many of us.

My income depends mostly on two things: social security and interest rates. During most of my working life, the latter averaged, say, 6%. Now it's close to zero -- bad for people like me with some savings. As for social security, it's scary to see it underfunded. Any decision to reduce or even suspend payroll taxes only makes that worse.

Investing in stocks -- especially overpriced ones -- is more risky for anyone who may not outlive the next bear market. And real estate, while attractive, means hands-on management. That gets harder with age.

So no, I don't see every American citizen benefitting from the policies of either candidate. I'd settle for breaking even.
 

E tank

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FYI- raising taxes on the “rich” and “big business” will still effect those downstream. Any basic economics course can teach you that.
Yeah...that one always gets me...my elderly mom's main source of income was a pension that was invested in the "rich" and "big business".

Really breathtaking how these folks so invested in class warfare can be so bold in taking advantage of their constituents ignorance to the point of their voting in direct contradiction to their own material best interests...
 

E tank

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I agree with the first sentence. As for the second, let me share the perspective of an old, retired guy with no paycheck. There are many of us.

My income depends mostly on two things: social security and interest rates. During most of my working life, the latter averaged, say, 6%. Now it's close to zero -- bad for people like me with some savings. As for social security, it's scary to see it underfunded. Any decision to reduce or even suspend payroll taxes only makes that worse.

Investing in stocks -- especially overpriced ones -- is more risky for anyone who may not outlive the next bear market. And real estate, while attractive, means hands-on management. That gets harder with age.

So no, I don't see every American citizen benefitting from the policies of either candidate. I'd settle for breaking even.

As far as investing in stocks...that's what reliable fund managers are for if doing it yourself is too edgy....and every American citizen will never benefit from any candidate...the question needs to be what will be the net disadvantage to more citizens if X is elected than not?
 

mgr22

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...the question needs to be what will be the net disadvantage to more citizens if X is elected than not?

I doubt anyone knows the answer to that question, although many think they do. We agree that no single candidate is best for everyone.
 

E tank

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I doubt anyone knows the answer to that question, although many think they do. We agree that no single candidate is best for everyone.
Right...but we have historical precedent against which to judge the varying ideologies, the differences of which are vast...
 

mgr22

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Right...but we have historical precedent against which to judge the varying ideologies, the differences of which are vast...

We can judge according to our own values, but I don't think there's a precedent for what our country is going through right now.
 

E tank

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We can judge according to our own values, but I don't think there's a precedent for what our country is going through right now.
Didn't say that...there is historical precedent for the ideologies...
 

johnrsemt

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My 401K from 2008 to 2016 grew on average of 9%.
From 2017 to March 2020 it grew 58%. March to July it grew 6%, July to September it grew 18%.
All while in the same high risk high earning section of Mutual funds of the system.

Former VP Biden has said multiple times that he is only going to raise taxes on people making over $400K, but then he says that he is going to get rid of President Trumps tax breaks that were put into place. Which gave married couples making less than $300K a $24,000 deduction, instead of the old $12,000 deduction. So that will hurt the 85% of the tax filers that didn't itemize their taxes.
 

E tank

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And what would those ideologies be?

Well, the one I'm most concerned about is the embrace of democratic socialism by voters under about 30 years old. Marxist ideology has become increasingly appealing to that demographic and is a significant component in the way the DNC has appealed to them.
 

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