Does this make my employer a criminal?

Is it crimanl

  • yes

    Votes: 9 81.8%
  • probably not, but should be

    Votes: 1 9.1%
  • no

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • dont care

    Votes: 1 9.1%

  • Total voters
    11

shorthairedpunk

Forum Lieutenant
153
0
0
I am no lawyer, the majority of my legal experience has been as a defendant, but I have a situation where my abusive employer has commited what I think may be criminal against an ex coworker.

Their defense on this will be that it is all sour grapes, which may be so, but nonetheless I think this is criminal in nature.

Here is the rundown:

I will call my ex co worker mike. We work for an ambulance service.

Mike was fired for poor performance, which is understandable. But during the course of employment we were required to purchase uniform shirts on our own. I took the logo to a local print shop and had them make up multiple shirts which I resold at cost to my coworkers.

After his termination Mike still has his shirts, which he purchased with his own money, to which i will attest. The logo on the shirts is non trademarked or copyrighted. The EMS insignia "Star of Life" is not official in that it does not have embroidered edges.

My employers contention is that Mike should return his shirts, to which he refuses. I dont blame him, they are his real property, they have no right to them. Even the implication od medical personell impersonation is voided in that there are FDNY shirts, etc commecially available.

When Mike went to retrieve his final paycheck, the manager refused to give it to him until he returned the shirts. He contacted the Illinois Department of Labor, who fowarded his call to a person who informed him that they could not legally withold his paycheck. They sent him forms to fill out to retrieve his pay. In the meantime, Mike informed The service what he was told and they did give him his check immediately.

The issue at hand now is that during the course of his employment, Mike did electrical repairs to one of the ambulances, which required the use of his digital multimeter. He left it on premesis intending on picking it up his next shift. He was terminated in the mean time.

When he requested his personal proerty be returned, the manager informed him (witnessed) that he could not have it back until he returned the shirts.



n. obtaining money or Property by threat to a victim's Property or loved ones, intimidation, or false claim of a right (such as pretending to be an IRS agent).

"It is a felony in all states, except that a direct threat to harm the victim is usually treated as the crime of robbery. Blackmail is a form of extortion in which the threat is to expose embarrassing, damaging information to family, friends or the public.See also: blackmail robbery theft."

That is the best legal definition of extortion I could find.

The property that the service is attempting to obtain is the shirts, the threat to the victims property is the theft of Mikes electronic multi meter, the intimidation is the position of authority that the manager holds within the company.

Am I correct in my interpretation that the manager, and possibly the company are guilty of the crime of extortion as well as theft?

I can guarantee that if Mike had the companies multimeter, he would be arrested for theft.

Though this is petty in nature, I believe it would still be considered a crime and should be prosecuted.

I have been working on a complaint for mike to send to the Illinois Attorney Generals Office as well as our County States attorney. I am unsure what wording to use, whether to cite ILCS or if I am directing the complaint to the proper authority.

Please let me know what you think about this situation, and whether I am correct in my assumption that this is in fact a criminal act on my employers part.
 

JJR512

Forum Deputy Chief
1,336
4
36
I think you should continue to pursue it.

I think you need only make a complaint to your local jurisdiction's DA, not the state's AG ("local jurisdiction" meaning where your employer is located, where this all took place).

It seems to constitute a criminal act on the employer's part. However, if your friend signed an employement contract that includes a clause that grants the employer the right to receive the materials they're asking for regardless of who paid for them, then the crime is nullified.

Also, just to point out something that I'm sure you're already aware of, by helping your friend against your employer, you're going to make your employer not like you. Technically (and legally) they can't fire you for what you're doing, but if they don't like you, they'll be looking for any other legal reason to get rid of you at the earliest opportunity. Say you show up half a minute late for work one day, and you'll be off to the unemployment line.
 
Last edited by a moderator:

Stevo

Forum Asst. Chief
885
3
18
I have been working on a complaint for mike to send to the Illinois Attorney Generals Office as well as our County States attorney. I am unsure what wording to use, whether to cite ILCS or if I am directing the complaint to the proper authority.

complaints directed at the proper authorities are probably Mike's best bet shorthairedpunk, i would also ask Mike if he has a sales reciept for the multimeter.

just expect it all to take time....

interesting piece on that star of life, i know quite a few people that have body ink stars, what would your employer do? ask for their arm or leg back?

~S~
 
OP
OP
S

shorthairedpunk

Forum Lieutenant
153
0
0
I bought some of the shirts with my credit card, so I have the reciepts

And knowing my employer, it would not suprise me if he tried to say the person had to have the tat removed lol
 

Chimpie

Site Administrator
Community Leader
6,368
812
113
SHP,

I agree that you should stay out of it. By helping "Mike" out I'm sure your employer will be looking at you next.

Regarding whether you should file a complaint first: before you spend your time and energy on this, your best bet is to ask a lawyer. They are one of the handful of people who can give you the most accurate recommendations.
 

MMiz

I put the M in EMTLife
Community Leader
5,519
401
83
It sure sounds illegal to me. I know there is an expectation that if I were to leave my service I am to return all of the uniforms and jackets they paid for, but I can't imagine that holds true for items that I purchased individually.

Let us know how this turns out.
 
OP
OP
S

shorthairedpunk

Forum Lieutenant
153
0
0
I was just thinking about it, if he is guilty of a crime in this, he did it while on shift, I wonder what effect that would have on his licensing in the state
 
OP
OP
S

shorthairedpunk

Forum Lieutenant
153
0
0
lol no, If I was mike, this would already be in a courtroom. I just cant stand seeing management at any job abuse employees, even if they are ex employees, its compounded when the management abuses their authority on a regular basis
 

ffemt8978

Forum Vice-Principal
Community Leader
11,025
1,475
113
I don't know if it's criminal or not, but your friend has the makings of a decent civil suit in small claims court. If the employer insists on getting the shirts, he is required to reimburse the employee for the expenses of obtaining the shirts. If he doesn't want to pay for them, he is not entitled to them.
 

JJR512

Forum Deputy Chief
1,336
4
36
In MD, my understanding of the laws (and this comes from me having been in management) is that if an employer requires an employee to wear an article of clothing of a specific color, then the employer must pay for that article of clothing, or reimburse the employee for it, or issue it to the employee. My experience comes from fast-food restaurant management, both with McDonald's and Taco Bell, and we would issue shirts, pants, and hats to employees, and require them to wear those items. But as for shoes, we could only ask that they wear "dark" shoes, rather than specifying black as we would have prefered, because if we were that specific about the color, then we would have been obligated to pay for the employee's shoes (or issue them ourselves).

My point is, in this state, as I understand things, this employer would not be able to require employees to purchase their own uniform shirts with specific designs on them.
 

Jon

Administrator
Community Leader
8,009
58
48
SHP - Welcome back... ;)


I'd keep my head low and not get involved, at least until I had a back-up job.

I'd advise "Mike" to talk with the local PD about the issue.... perhaps a officer showing up with mike to get the multimeter back would work.

If that doesen't work, the PD will probably tell you who to go to next.
 
OP
OP
S

shorthairedpunk

Forum Lieutenant
153
0
0
I just really want to see him hang, if he lost his job this late in the game it would more than make up for the people whos career he personally made it a point to ruin or not even begin.
 
Top