AMR Escorted

wtferick

wtferick

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Kind of a weird thing to be asking haha
But does anyone have or know the video where AMR is transporting to children's hospital escorted by PD/ sheriffs. Believe this happened in Acton/Lancaster area in LA County.

Really want to show my partner the video lol

Thanks!
 
gonefishing

gonefishing

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wtferick said:
Kind of a weird thing to be asking haha
But does anyone have or know the video where AMR is transporting to children's hospital escorted by PD/ sheriffs. Believe this happened in Acton/Lancaster area in LA County.

Really want to show my partner the video lol

Thanks!
Click to expand...
I will try and dig that up for you. I know exactly what your talking about.

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H

Handsome Robb

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DEmedic said:
What... the...
Click to expand...

Perfect time to go knock off the 7-11 since every LEO in town is tied up in a parade...


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ffemt8978

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I've seen parades that were shorter.
 
Giant81

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It's sad that they felt they couldn't land at the soccer field because of players and spectators. I don't get why it would have been difficult to just have the players get off the field and delay the game while they used it as an HLZ? Better for the PT, safer for the public, and those players would have a pretty crazy story to tell. Am I missing something?

Not to mention good PR.
 
D

DesertMedic66

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Giant81 said:
It's sad that they felt they couldn't land at the soccer field because of players and spectators. I don't get why it would have been difficult to just have the players get off the field and delay the game while they used it as an HLZ? Better for the PT, safer for the public, and those players would have a pretty crazy story to tell. Am I missing something?

Not to mention good PR.
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I don't blame them for not wanting to land on an occupied soccer field with spectators. As a ground paramedic I would not set up an LZ there. Huge potential for something to go wrong. How do you feel about this @VentMonkey
 
VentMonkey

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Giant81 said:
It's sad that they felt they couldn't land at the soccer field because of players and spectators. I don't get why it would have been difficult to just have the players get off the field and delay the game while they used it as an HLZ? Better for the PT, safer for the public, and those players would have a pretty crazy story to tell. Am I missing something?

Not to mention good PR.
Click to expand...
Yes, you're missing a lot it sounds like. I will admit I haven't looked at this thread in quite some time, and honestly thought it was in reference to the LASD escorting an ambulance as a professional courtesy somewhere, big whoop.

Things are oftentimes done as overkill in that county. As far as your reasonings, I'm just not quite sure I follow. The "HEMS" agencies--if we can even call them that--are provided by the city fire department, county fire department, and LASD sheriff paramedics.

I'm not sure what this call was for, but guessing by the ops original question, it involved an acutely ill child. If it was in fact a "scene call" within their county that did not have access to an appropriate EDAP, or PCCC, then perhaps this is why they requested a helicopter.

Now, back to your comment. The agencies mentioned above all staff their helicopters with paramedics trained at the ALS level, nothing more, nothing less. They also have various helicopters. Typically the LACoFD will send their firehawks, maybe their 412. LASD just replaced their Sikorsky's with Super Pumas; these are massive (see, not your standard HEMS) helicopters.

As far as why they may not have "just landed" in a soccer field. It doesn't work that way. I created a thread re: LZ's if that helps you understand a bit better. Try to imagine a field full of people being ushered off to the side to land a helicopter when it may be much more facilitating to land them somewhere else up the road a bit more open with less bystanders.

As far as a PR event? Yeah, on scene of a call is hardly the time for PR. That's across the board with any public agency. Think about it another way:

How often are bystanders who do mean well obstructing calls because they "mean well"? Now add to this the noise, excitement, and chaos a loud aircraft brings. The biggest thing with air ops is safety. Our safety, the patients safety, and the publics safety. It hardly seems safe to just pick a spot blindly.

We're in a small single-engine aircraft and hardly feel safe unless we have adequate ingress and egress. If on average you want people back 150', how difficult do you think it would be to usher a slew of people back that far? It can be hard enough with just a handful of people, including trained staff.
 
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Giant81

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I'm from a rural area where HLZs are literally everywhere. Hay fields, pastures, soccer/football field, open areas at parks, stretches of lightly traveled roadway, etc... not to mention our shortest transport even with full lights and sirens is 20+ minutes away after we start rolling. I'd personally never land a helicopter under almost any circumstances in a soccer/football field due to the light poles anyway, but we have an over abundance of wide open spaces with nothing higher than a shrub for 1/4 mile that make better LZs.

I also didn't think to take into consideration for level of care. Two of the helicopters out here that cover my area have a Trauma doctor and ER nurse on board which, I suspect, carry with it, a full compliment of things above what a paramedic can do. Though I suspect there is a point of diminishing returns, eventually you just need the resources available to you in an ED regardless of your licensing level. Not to mention we have no paramedics in the county, so even a paramedic staffed bird is a good jump up from what we can provide at the AEMT level at best.

I guess as far as public safety goes by trying to maintain crowd control, I fell for thinking that since I would be easily moved by emergency personnel to a safe distance and keep my distance, that everyone else would be.

When you take into account the shorter transport time, the same level of care between bus and bird, and the the lack of a suitable LZ, I can see why they chose to go by ground.
 
VentMonkey

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Giant81 said:
I'm from a rural area where HLZs are literally everywhere. Hay fields, pastures, soccer/football field, open areas at parks, stretches of lightly traveled roadway, etc... not to mention our shortest transport even with full lights and sirens is 20+ minutes away after we start rolling. I'd personally never land a helicopter under almost any circumstances in a soccer/football field due to the light poles anyway, but we have an over abundance of wide open spaces with nothing higher than a shrub for 1/4 mile that make better LZs.

I also didn't think to take into consideration for level of care. Two of the helicopters out here that cover my area have a Trauma doctor and ER nurse on board which, I suspect, carry with it, a full compliment of things above what a paramedic can do. Though I suspect there is a point of diminishing returns, eventually you just need the resources available to you in an ED regardless of your licensing level. Not to mention we have no paramedics in the county, so even a paramedic staffed bird is a good jump up from what we can provide at the AEMT level at best.

I guess as far as public safety goes by trying to maintain crowd control, I fell for thinking that since I would be easily moved by emergency personnel to a safe distance and keep my distance, that everyone else would be.

When you take into account the shorter transport time, the same level of care between bus and bird, and the the lack of a suitable LZ, I can see why they chose to go by ground.
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The LZ itself isn't the issue, it's crowd control or potential for lack there of.

We have a handful of "designated" LZ's that are football fields, but landing at one that's been secured and had public access cut off until lifting off of the scene vs. one with dozens of unsuspecting bystanders is a significant different.
 
Jim37F

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VentMonkey said:
Yes, you're missing a lot it sounds like. I will admit I haven't looked at this thread in quite some time, and honestly thought it was in reference to the LASD escorting an ambulance as a professional courtesy somewhere, big whoop.

Things are oftentimes done as overkill in that county. As far as your reasonings, I'm just not quite sure I follow. The "HEMS" agencies--if we can even call them that--are provided by the city fire department, county fire department, and LASD sheriff paramedics.

I'm not sure what this call was for, but guessing by the ops original question, it involved an acutely ill child. If it was in fact a "scene call" within their county that did not have access to an appropriate EDAP, or PCCC, then perhaps this is why they requested a helicopter.

Now, back to your comment. The agencies mentioned above all staff their helicopters with paramedics trained at the ALS level, nothing more, nothing less. They also have various helicopters. Typically the LACoFD will send their firehawks, maybe their 412. LASD just replaced their Sikorsky's with Super Pumas; these are massive (see, not your standard HEMS) helicopters.

As far as why they may not have "just landed" in a soccer field. It doesn't work that way. I created a thread re: LZ's if that helps you understand a bit better. Try to imagine a field full of people being ushered off to the side to land a helicopter when it may be much more facilitating to land them somewhere else up the road a bit more open with less bystanders.

As far as a PR event? Yeah, on scene of a call is hardly the time for PR. That's across the board with any public agency. Think about it another way:

How often are bystanders who do mean well obstructing calls because they "mean well"? Now add to this the noise, excitement, and chaos a loud aircraft brings. The biggest thing with air ops is safety. Our safety, the patients safety, and the publics safety. It hardly seems safe to just pick a spot blindly.

We're in a small single-engine aircraft and hardly feel safe unless we have adequate ingress and egress. If on average you want people back 150', how difficult do you think it would be to usher a slew of people back that far? It can be hard enough with just a handful of people, including trained staff.
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Yeah we actually get the County Firehawks flying people out fairly regularly where I live since the closest trauma center is in downtown and is a good 20-30 min drive with no traffic. They routinely use school's football fields or the college's ginormous soccer fields as LZ's, though I don't think they've ever shut down a game in progress, so much easier just to go to the next HS over that doesn't have a crowd of people already in the way...
 
VentMonkey

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Jim37F said:
Yeah we actually get the County Firehawks flying people out fairly regularly where I live since the closest trauma center is in downtown and is a good 20-30 min drive with no traffic. They routinely use school's football fields or the college's ginormous soccer fields as LZ's, though I don't think they've ever shut down a game in progress, so much easier just to go to the next HS over that doesn't have a crowd of people already in the way...
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The only time they did this in my "LA days" was for a "trauma" in Whittier. I stick by my statements earlier, it's super ridiculous overkill.
 
gonefishing

gonefishing

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VentMonkey said:
Yes, you're missing a lot it sounds like. I will admit I haven't looked at this thread in quite some time, and honestly thought it was in reference to the LASD escorting an ambulance as a professional courtesy somewhere, big whoop.

Things are oftentimes done as overkill in that county. As far as your reasonings, I'm just not quite sure I follow. The "HEMS" agencies--if we can even call them that--are provided by the city fire department, county fire department, and LASD sheriff paramedics.

I'm not sure what this call was for, but guessing by the ops original question, it involved an acutely ill child. If it was in fact a "scene call" within their county that did not have access to an appropriate EDAP, or PCCC, then perhaps this is why they requested a helicopter.

Now, back to your comment. The agencies mentioned above all staff their helicopters with paramedics trained at the ALS level, nothing more, nothing less. They also have various helicopters. Typically the LACoFD will send their firehawks, maybe their 412. LASD just replaced their Sikorsky's with Super Pumas; these are massive (see, not your standard HEMS) helicopters.

As far as why they may not have "just landed" in a soccer field. It doesn't work that way. I created a thread re: LZ's if that helps you understand a bit better. Try to imagine a field full of people being ushered off to the side to land a helicopter when it may be much more facilitating to land them somewhere else up the road a bit more open with less bystanders.

As far as a PR event? Yeah, on scene of a call is hardly the time for PR. That's across the board with any public agency. Think about it another way:

How often are bystanders who do mean well obstructing calls because they "mean well"? Now add to this the noise, excitement, and chaos a loud aircraft brings. The biggest thing with air ops is safety. Our safety, the patients safety, and the publics safety. It hardly seems safe to just pick a spot blindly.

We're in a small single-engine aircraft and hardly feel safe unless we have adequate ingress and egress. If on average you want people back 150', how difficult do you think it would be to usher a slew of people back that far? It can be hard enough with just a handful of people, including trained staff.
Click to expand...
Call was for a kid that drowned

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