Actual qualified medics.

[TachticalFire89]

This may sound like a rant that most of you have heard before but since i am new to this line of work i have to get this off my chest...i am a certified firemam and Emt Basic since there are no fire stations hiring in my area i decided to get more patient contacts and get a job as an Emt Basic. I now work for a private ems company pretty much hauling around the elserly to diaylisis or dentist appointments. Dont get me wrong i am very grateful to even be doing this at the end of the day its still expirence BUT what has had me pissed off for a few days now is when i was talking to another "Driver" as they call us that person is not even certifeid as an emt or anything no training what so ever so your telling me that i bust my *** getting nationally and state certified when theres ppl out here who can get in the same line of work that i bust my *** to get into without any training!! Thats absured and i think this is a problem with ****ty patient care these days smh how do some of you new EMT's feel about this!?

 

[StCEMT]

To be fair, you don't really need two EMT's to do dialysis and dentist transfers. They aren't going to touch a 911 truck though, so they won't really be doing the same line of work when when all things settle.

 

[TransportJockey]

And also, EMT-Basic is not a hard certification or class to pass and obtain. But there are places that just hire drivers out there. It happens, and they shouldn't be doing patient care, so saying that they are the reason renal roundup crews provide ****ty care is not accurate.

 

[TachticalFire89]

And i want to add the first day thrown to the wolves...seeing non certified personnel transporting phyc, epileptic and other critical patients. I even saw two men get out of the front seats of an ambulance while the patient was alone on a stretcher in the patient compartment they were wearing jeans and polos with an ems logo stitched to the sleeve. The rig they were in looked like jeepers creepers transportation...this makes me feel like my career choice isnt as respected as i thought

 

[TachticalFire89]

And also, EMT-Basic is not a hard certification or class to pass and obtain. But there are places that just hire drivers out there. It happens, and they shouldn't be doing patient care, so saying that they are the reason renal roundup crews provide ****ty care is not accurate.

I understand what your saying i really do but look at it from my perspective im new to this i did fire academy last year then i finished my emt course and passed the nremt in august...few months later i get a job with an ems company only to realize all those hrs and training i put in and studying im working alongside non certified ppl i do bls and transfers by the way

 

[EpiEMS]

only to realize all those hrs and training i put in and studying im working alongside non certified ppl

Private EMS is a business like any other...if they can hire non-certified people as drivers and save money without getting in trouble, they'd be remiss for not doing so.

 

[VentMonkey]

One question- where does the “actual qualified medics” portion of your rant come into play?

 

[VFlutter]

And i want to add the first day thrown to the wolves...seeing non certified personnel transporting phyc, epileptic and other critical patients.

What do you consider a "critical patient"?. Do these patients need actual medical care, if so what can you provide, or do they really just a ride to the next appointment?

.this makes me feel like my career choice isnt as respected as i thought

Hate to burst your bubble but it isn't very well respected in the medical community and to be honest for good reason.

 

[EpiEMS]

Do these patients need actual medical care, if so what can you provide, or do they really just a ride to the next appointment?

To that point, CMS has really started to crack down on this kind of abuse for Medicare, namely.

 

[DrParasite]

when i was talking to another "Driver" as they call us that person is not even certifeid as an emt or anything no training what so ever so your telling me that i bust my *** getting nationally and state certified when theres ppl out here who can get in the same line of work that i bust my *** to get into without any training!!

Did you ask him how much he was being paid? If he was being paid more (which I highly doubt), than I think you got hired by a crappy company who is taking advantage of you, and you should apply to where he was working. I suspect he is getting paid less... possibly much less.

BTW, your working in IFT doing renal runs, that part of the field hasn't (historically) recruited the best and the brightest. Maybe you should talk to someone who works full time on a 911 truck... It can be an entirely different world.

Also, you should probably work on your spelling and grammar, because based on that first post, you might have missed some of those classes in high school (especially when it comes to run on sentences....)

And i want to add the first day thrown to the wolves...seeing non certified personnel transporting phyc, epileptic and other critical patients.

just for clarification: so you saw two non-EMTs transporting a psych patient in an ambulance? or an epileptic ? or a critical patient? I find that very unlikely.

I even saw two men get out of the front seats of an ambulance while the patient was alone on a stretcher in the patient compartment they were wearing jeans and polos with an ems logo stitched to the sleeve. The rig they were in looked like jeepers creepers transportation...this makes me feel like my career choice isnt as respected as i thought

And you called the number on the side of ambulance and reported what you saw to a supervisor right? and if you didn't like what they said, you contacted the department of health (or whatever regulating body oversees EMS in your state) and told them what you witnessed right? After all, if you witnessed this atrocity and did nothing to resolve it, than you are 1) whining 2) ranting online, yet not actually willing to do anything to correct the problem and 3) and letting their appearance and actions reflect poorly on you.

Private EMS is a business like any other...if they can hire non-certified people as drivers and save money without getting in trouble, they'd be remiss for not doing so.

Which is exactly why NJ requires all paid ambulances (private, public, 911 or IFT) to have 2 EMTs minimum. Private EMS, especially small for profit entities (as a general rule, but there are exceptions), will only put the bare minimum on the truck, because anything above that will cut into their overall profits.

Hate to burst your bubble but it isn't very well respected in the medical community and to be honest for good reason.

Just like nurses in SNFs aren't well respected, and proctologists spend their days dealing with a-holes....

Some individuals are well respected, some agencies are well respected (at least at a regional level), but we still have other healthcare providers who insist on calling us ambulance drivers. And there are a few MDs and nurses that I don't respect, and I am pretty sure they don't lose sleep over it.... So why should I?

 

[VentMonkey]

Some individuals are well respected, some agencies are well respected (at least at a regional level). And there are a few MDs and nurses that I don't respect, and I am pretty sure they don't lose sleep over it.... So why should I?

This^^^, to the tenth power. Who cares, OP? Your outlook is setting you up for imminent failure.

 

[EpiEMS]

Which is exactly why NJ requires all paid ambulances (private, public, 911 or IFT) to have 2 EMTs minimum. Private EMS, especially small for profit entities (as a general rule, but there are exceptions), will only put the bare minimum on the truck, because anything above that will cut into their overall profits.

I know this is a bit of a tangent to the thread on my part...

In theory, sure, it makes sense to have two equally certified providers. In practice, however, I am not convinced that it (1) improves outcomes or (2) is cost effective. An EMR can drive just as well as an EMT.

 

[DrParasite]

We can start a new thread about the reasons to have two trained providers on one vehicle, and if it is worthwhile both from a patient care level and cost effectiveness. But in response to this particular statement

An EMR can drive just as well as an EMT.

so why not just pair a taxi driver with a paramedic? all they need is a driver to get them from point A to point B, the guy in the back does all the work. No need to be an EMT at all. And you have an ambulance capable of handling every prehospital emergency. Right?

Although, to support your point, I haven't heard the paramedics on these forums say many good things about the EMTs that are paired with.... so my POV might be a little jaded because I came from a tiered system where both EMTs and Paramedics on the ambulance are supposed to be able to think for themselves, without someone else always telling them what to do. your experiences (or anyone else's) might result in them having a different opinion.

 

[EpiEMS]

all they need is a driver to get them from point A to point B, the guy in the back does all the work.

Other than lifting, yeah, that's pretty much true for many calls - you don't need two people to provide care on most BLS or IFT calls, and on most ALS calls, VOMIT is really the name of the game. This is especially sufficient if you have BLS or ALS FF or LEOs showing up to calls, too.

 

[StCEMT]

@DrParasite for BLS IFT, I doubt an EMR is really all that bad. The majority of the thinking I had to do those days was how to best move the patient. Two EMT's didn't mean much overall.

As far as EMT partners, I have had many great ones. The fresh 19 year old ones can be hard to work with. My old partner was great though. Some calls may be outside my comfort zone, but I had absolute in our confidence to run any call together as far as team dynamics go.

 

[EpiEMS]

The majority of the thinking I had to do those days was how to best move the patient.

Basic Lifting Service
I think this holds for (most) calls appropriately EMD for BLS response.

 

[akflightmedic]

I am gonna slap you around with some reality. Both your grammar and spelling are atrocious. You do not need to be an English Major but for crying out loud....the run on sentence, poor sentence structure,misspellings and thought splashing are just off the charts---and not in a good way.

So I find irony in the fact you speak about professionalism, lack of respect, "all the education", etc yet come on here and give a piss poor representation of our field, the one you are trying to (defend?).

As for having drivers only, if the rules/laws allow for it, then a business should do what they can to earn revenue. Is it ethical or best practice? Maybe, maybe not. However, as long as they are within the laws then there is not much which can be done. Sloppy, unprofessional uniforms...again not tasteful but no law against it. As for the "critical" patients you witnessed, are you sure you had/have all the facts? Or is this a big assumption being operated on due to that massive chip on your shoulder?

In short, legit rants are fine...key word being legit. If there is a problem, did you report it as one poster above mentioned? If not, then you are part of the problem.

I do not understand why you are angry at "the driver" you work with and compare it to all the efforts you have made to secure YOUR future. That man or woman saw an ad and applied for a job in which they were qualified for. A legit job. Why are you hating on them for not having any higher education? They are supporting themselves, their family, what did they do to deserve your disdain and ivory tower perspective? You said it yourself, you are doing this until you secure the job you want. So do that. Go to work, do your job, do it with a smile and keep looking for the greener grass. But damn dude, to hate on a coworker cause they have a job and basically it is the same role/responsibility as yours??? WTF?

And I do hope your screen name was an intentional misspelling, unlike all the other errors in your first post.

 

[SandpitMedic]

Glad @akflightmedic said it.
Jeeze...

In my opinion, it sounds like you, OP, unloaded a dump truck full of butt-hurt that you have yet to get a professional fire gig.

EMT Basics, no offense to those who are, are a dime a dozen, and is an entry level certification.

Get over yourself.

 

[Tigger]

We can start a new thread about the reasons to have two trained providers on one vehicle, and if it is worthwhile both from a patient care level and cost effectiveness. But in response to this particular statementso why not just pair a taxi driver with a paramedic? all they need is a driver to get them from point A to point B, the guy in the back does all the work. No need to be an EMT at all. And you have an ambulance capable of handling every prehospital emergency. Right?

Although, to support your point, I haven't heard the paramedics on these forums say many good things about the EMTs that are paired with.... so my POV might be a little jaded because I came from a tiered system where both EMTs and Paramedics on the ambulance are supposed to be able to think for themselves, without someone else always telling them what to do. your experiences (or anyone else's) might result in them having a different opinion.

Our second out ambulance roles with a single paramedic and that's it. Our insurance allows anyone to drive the ambulance provided they have a driver's license. I really never want such a thing to happen, but that means I have might have cop or volunteer, non-medical firefighter driving me. So yes, we could have a taxi driver. Running legit calls with such a setup sucks, but it gives us flexibility to provide more paramedics over a large rural area.

 

[medichopeful]

(snip)seeing non certified personnel transporting phyc, epileptic and other critical patients. (snip)

Define "critical"?

If you can't define it, go spend an 8-hour shift in a high-acuity ICU. It might help you with the definition.