Duty to Act Info

[KillTank]

Not for nothing, but unless you carry a jump kit in your POV, how much aid can you actually render at the scene of an accident?

Sticker or no sticker, I just don't see how these laws are enforceable. Without the proper supplies/equipment, all you're going to do is get in the way.

you do not need supplies to perform CPR, hold c spine or control bleeding...

 

[DHarris52]

you do not need supplies to perform CPR, hold c spine or control bleeding...

...I guess you don't subscribe to the whole concept of BSI.

 

[JPINFV]

I'll give you bleeding control, but unless the patient is covered in bodily fluid, then a few minutes of c-spine or compression only CPR isn't going to kill you. I'm willing to bet that money is far more dirty than the vast majority of EMS patients who aren't covered in bodily fluids.

 

[DHarris52]

I'll give you bleeding control, but unless the patient is covered in bodily fluid, then a few minutes of c-spine or compression only CPR isn't going to kill you. I'm willing to bet that money is far more dirty than the vast majority of EMS patients who aren't covered in bodily fluids.

And what about personal safety?

You're telling me that if I am on my way home from a BBQ wearing a pair of shorts, sandals, and a polo, I am expected to crawl into a car littered with broken glass and twisted metal to take C-Spine because I have the duty to act?

The point that I'm trying to make is I just don't see how these duty to act "laws" are enforceable. Every situation is different and there's just too many variables to be able to follow something that is written in black and white.

 

[KillTank]

And what about personal safety?

You're telling me that if I am on my way home from a BBQ wearing a pair of shorts, sandals, and a polo, I am expected to crawl into a car littered with broken glass and twisted metal to take C-Spine because I have the duty to act?

The point that I'm trying to make is I just don't see how these duty to act "laws" are enforceable. Every situation is different and there's just too many variables to be able to follow something that is written in black and white.

I agree with what you say and I do not believe in the duty to act law. Trust me If I was put in a unsafe condition I would not act. But if I am able to assist without putting myself or anyone in danger then I will.

 

[reaper]

If you go through this entire thread, you will find that there is maybe two states that have duty to act laws. So most people do not have to worry about it.

The ones that have the law, are no worries. They are not enforceable laws. Stop if you feel the need or just call 911. The choice is yours and yours only!

 

[bridgestrong]

Duty to act

Surprisingly Romania have one in place and it is more a 'law to act'. Let me contact a colleague in EMS there and see if i can acquire a copy.

 

[Scottpre]

Duty act

I consider my duty to act more like a "duty to notify". I always report accidents, etc that I see unless I see PD or some other emergency unit is already there. I figure making a phone only takes a second.

I have a jump bag in the trunk, but it's for SAR missions. I've used it once to splint a broken arm in a parking lot so the lady's husband could take to her to the ER.

I'll stop at an accident if no else is there and it looks like it may have injuries or is a multiple MVA. Other than that, I just call it in and continue on my merry way.

 

[DrParasite]

From an email I sent to the NJDOH regarding a semi-related issue:

According to the [New Jersey] Department [of Health] attorney, the act of placing an EMT sticker on your private vehicle does not constitute the obligation to stop and render aid. Generally speaking you do not have a duty to act unless you make verbal or physical contact with someone requiring the skills of an EMT. Having said this you should contact your squad attorney for legal clarification in this area.

I hope this have been helpful.


Thomas Hendrickson, RN, MSN, EMT-B
Office of Emergency Medical Services, NJ Department of Health

 

[PhilipM3]

Georgia does not have any Duty to Act laws, pertaining to an off-duty EMT.

 

[jrbigelow]

Wyoming Good Samaritan Law



1-1-120.



Persons rendering emergency assistance exempt from civil liability.



(a) Any person licensed as a physician and surgeon under the laws of the state of Wyoming, or any other person, who in good faith renders emergency care or assistance without compensation at the place of an emergency or accident, is not liable for any civil damages for acts or omissions in good faith.



(b) Persons or organizations operating volunteer ambulances or rescue vehicles supported by public or private funds, staffed by unpaid volunteers, and which make no charge for services rendered during medical emergencies, and the unpaid volunteers who staff ambulances and rescue vehicles are not liable for any civil damages for acts or omissions in good faith in furnishing emergency medical services. This immunity does not apply to acts or omissions constituting gross negligence or willful or wanton misconduct.





(c) Any person who provides assistance or advice without compensation other than reimbursement of out-of-pocket expenses in mitigating or attempting to mitigate the effects of an actual or threatened discharge of hazardous materials, or in preventing, cleaning up or disposing of or in attempting to prevent, clean up or dispose of any discharge of hazardous materials, is not liable for any civil damages for acts or omissions in good faith in providing the assistance or advice. This immunity does not apply to acts or omissions constituting gross negligence or willful or wanton misconduct. As used in this subsection:



(i) "Discharge" includes leakage, seepage or other release;



(ii) "Hazardous materials" includes all materials and substances which are now or hereafter designated or defined as hazardous by any state or federal law or by the regulations of any state or federal government agency.

 

[airraid]

How many of you would NOT act while off-duty?

 

[SammyGirlMedic]

Ohio doesn't have it. Sorry no link, only what I've learned.

I was told we do have A Duty to Act Law in Ohio, but couldn't find something on line right now. I was also told that it is "very easy to get around it" by quoting certain things such as, "The scene was unsafe," or "I had no BSI equipment."

 

[SammyGirlMedic]

How many of you would NOT act while off-duty?

I would call something in, but I don't know if I'd do more? I don't carry a bag of medical equipment with me, so I don't think I'd be much more help than anyone else. If I saw someone choking, I'd do the Heimlich, but what else could I do than that?

 

[VentMedic]

I was told we do have A Duty to Act Law in Ohio, but couldn't find something on line right now. I was also told that it is "very easy to get around it" by quoting certain things such as, "The scene was unsafe," or "I had no BSI equipment."

Good reads:

http://www.emsresponder.com/publication/article.jsp?pubId=1&id=2046

http://theemtspot.com/2009/06/23/what-is-the-duty-to-act/

Unless you are compensated by your employer or covered under their insurance or you are part of a Public Safety agency (FD, PD, CO), to where you are required to respond, you have no duty to act and would not be covered if you were injured. Thus, the duty to act that is written into EMS statutes is meant for those on duty. If you are legally bound by an employer to perform as an EMT while on duty and you fail to meet that expectation, you are guilty of failing to act. That is the question right now in NYC with the two EMT dispatchers. Did they have a duty to act while in uniform but not with an "EMT" job description and while being on break? If they had not been in uniform and not working as EMTs, there is a chance nothing would ever have been said about this tragic event.

I would call something in, but I don't know if I'd do more? I don't carry a bag of medical equipment with me, so I don't think I'd be much more help than anyone else. If I saw someone choking, I'd do the Heimlich, but what else could I do than that?

You do whatever a layperson would do, provided the scene is safe, and that can be a considerable amount even if it is emotional support and ensuring rescuers get to the scene by calling 911.

 

[fire_911medic]

Here it is entirely dependent on your medical director, but if you have ANY identifying things (ie in uniform, have something on your car, person identifying you with a dept - even fire as all paid fire depts are at least trained to basic level - plates on your car, etc) and other rescue personnel (not neccessarily medical) are not already on scene, you are required to stop and render aid until another rescue person has arrived. However, you are only allowed to act to the level permitted by your medical director off duty - each county has different requirements and some play better with others :glare: .

Having said that - it doesn't matter if someone knows you to be a basic, medic, if you don't identify yourself in anyway as being a trained caregiver, then you can drive on by, walk on by with no adverse action.

 

[reaper]

Where is here? There is no Medical Director that can tell me what to do when off duty. If it is a state law, then we are looking for a link to it.

 

[VentMedic]

as all paid fire depts are at least trained to basic level - plates on your car, etc) and other rescue personnel (not neccessarily medical) are not already on scene, you are required to stop and render aid until another rescue person has arrived. However, you are only allowed to act to the level permitted by your medical director off duty - each county has different requirements and some play better with others :glare: .

So you do have full insurance coverage off duty? Are you also considered back on the clock with call back pay?

 

[wolfwyndd]

Where is here? There is no Medical Director that can tell me what to do when off duty. If it is a state law, then we are looking for a link to it.

You know, I use that exact same arguement in the non - smoking arguement. How can an employer tell me I CAN'T smoke when I'm offduty? But hey, I'm just a lowly peon. What do I know?

I was told we do have A Duty to Act Law in Ohio, but couldn't find something on line right now. I was also told that it is "very easy to get around it" by quoting certain things such as, "The scene was unsafe," or "I had no BSI equipment."

Really now? I think someone told you inaccurately. Having been a practicing FF/EMT in SW Ohio for 7 years now, I've NEVER found, or even been told / taught, a duty to act law exists in this State. Of course, new laws come in all the time and there's a few that kicked in as of the 1st of the year that I'm not familiar with. There may be a COUNTY of LOCAL jurisdiction rule, but it's not Statewide.

So you do have full insurance coverage off duty? Are you also considered back on the clock with call back pay?

Yes, as long as I'm in my own jurisdiction and I stop to render aid to someone that needs it, yes, I'm covered and 'on the clock' whether I started off on the clock or not. In a neighboring jurisdiction I'm still covered by Good Samaritan Laws.

 

[VentMedic]

You know, I use that exact same arguement in the non - smoking arguement. How can an employer tell me I CAN'T smoke when I'm offduty? But hey, I'm just a lowly peon. What do I know?

Are your lungs magically better when you are at work?

You would not work for many FDs that do not want people claiming their emphysema as an occupational hazard especially if you smoke more packs of cigarettes each day than fires worked for the entire year.

Your on/off duty compensation sounds like you work for a Public Safety or your ambulance service is now recognized as such in your state.