Do I need a medical director?

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SeanMalone

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I have been asked to provide EMS coverage for a horse show in NY state since I am currently an EMT. I have my own supply of BLS equipment including oral glucose, aspirin, and 02 to bring with me. My question is, do I need a medical director and NYS agency number? Thanks in advance
 
Yes.

But, not if you leave the o2 aspirin and glucose at home.

You do not have the right to administer medications without medical direction.

You can take vitals, and give out all the bandaids you want.

They are hiring you for your background primarily in these cases.
 
I am looking for something in the public health code that speaks specifically to this topic, or some other sort of case law not just an opinion
 
I'm sure someone here can provide you with a legal reference, but I can guarantee you there is 0 chance you can legally do anything past basic first aid.

As an EMT/paramedic you do not possess your own medical license. You may only function under the supervisory of a medical director. Without such, you are practicing medicine without a license, which is a felony.

You can take vitals all you want and basically anything non-invasive that any person off the street could realistically do.
 
You guys don't have any standing orders for any medications over there?

(Just trying to compare systems, out of curiosity.)
 
AnthonyM83 said:
You guys don't have any standing orders for any medications over there?

(Just trying to compare systems, out of curiosity.)
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Standing orders doesn't mean you can do what you want... They are standing orders approved by the medical director you work under.

I have epi and benadryl SO for allergic reactions doesn't mean I can drive around in my car and give it to someone I happen I come across.
 
NYMedic828 said:
I have epi and benadryl SO for allergic reactions doesn't mean I can drive around in my car and give it to someone I happen I come across.
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Well you CAN, but don't expect to be a paramedic for much longer :lol:

I agree with NYMedic, beyond first aid you need to have a medical director. Hell, even then you should probably still have one for CYA purposes.

And standing orders are written orders from your medical director, they only apply when you are working. Paramedics do not have a license to practice medicine (or nursing, or engineering, or anything at all). We are certified that we have a certain body of knowledge, from there a physician extends his license to us so that we can preform skills that s/he approves. Since those skills are performed under his/her license, we cannot do anything unless we are currently covered by it.
 
SeanMalone said:
I have been asked to provide EMS coverage for a horse show in NY state since I am currently an EMT. I have my own supply of BLS equipment including oral glucose, aspirin, and 02 to bring with me. My question is, do I need a medical director and NYS agency number? Thanks in advance
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I'm confused. You claim your an EMT, yet you aren't aware about the medical director requirements? Sorry, but that is covered in one of the first chapters of the textbook.

You also claim you don't have an agency number, how are you an EMT?

My assumption is that you are not the certified EMT you claim to be. Any EMT knows the legal requirements to perform the job.

I really don't care if you want to walk around and give out band-aids till your blue in the face. But if your going to be practicing REAL EMT skills then you better be certified and be in compliance with all laws and regulations.

Failure to meet the legal requirements can result in severe legal consequences, including jail time.

Sorry, but you seem fishy to me.
 
leoemt said:
I'm confused. You claim your an EMT, yet you aren't aware about the medical director requirements? Sorry, but that is covered in one of the first chapters of the textbook.

You also claim you don't have an agency number, how are you an EMT?

My assumption is that you are not the certified EMT you claim to be. Any EMT knows the legal requirements to perform the job.

I really don't care if you want to walk around and give out band-aids till your blue in the face. But if your going to be practicing REAL EMT skills then you better be certified and be in compliance with all laws and regulations.

Failure to meet the legal requirements can result in severe legal consequences, including jail time.

Sorry, but you seem fishy to me.
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I think you MASSIVELY overestimate the level of competence of a good portion of EMS.

I could have passed my EMT course and state test on the sole basis of knowing that scene safety is my primary concern.

Also, what do we honestly consider "real" EMT skills? Most of the fancy ways you get taught to apply bandages and splints annoy the heck out of the receiving caregiver when they have to get them off.
 
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Like others have said you need to have medical direction to function or work as an EMT. If you work or volly for a service you may be able to do "event coverage" if you medical director and service approve of it.


Why do you have your own O2? Unless it was issued to you by your service you should never carry let alone use it on a pt. You are asking for a lot of trouble by doing so.
 
Oxygen isn't necessarily Rx only (e.g. http://www.lifecorporation.com/). AHA teaches o2 use for lay responders.

However, you as an EMT are limited in scope without medical direction. That's a given.
 
NYMedic828 said:
Standing orders doesn't mean you can do what you want... They are standing orders approved by the medical director you work under.

I have epi and benadryl SO for allergic reactions doesn't mean I can drive around in my car and give it to someone I happen I come across.
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It's different in California for EMTs. The local EMS agency MD is your medical director, which is enough to practice on your own. All based on standing orders. You have an agency medical director only if you're on-duty for a company.

The agency and medical director requirement the local paramedics is similar to what you're describing for your EMTs there. Must be on-duty with an agency in order to do their ALS procedures.

Again, just curious, that's why I asked.
 
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So lets say that a facility has its own AED, first aid kit, and resuscitation equipment.... an EMT can use that to give care and be protected by good Samaritan style laws in NY. How is it any different if they have their own first aid kit (never mind the "drugs" for now) and use it on someone in the street?
 
You also do not need an agency affiliation to get an EMT number in New York
 
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leoemt said:
I'm confused. You claim your an EMT, yet you aren't aware about the medical director requirements? Sorry, but that is covered in one of the first chapters of the textbook.

You also claim you don't have an agency number, how are you an EMT?

My assumption is that you are not the certified EMT you claim to be. Any EMT knows the legal requirements to perform the job.

I really don't care if you want to walk around and give out band-aids till your blue in the face. But if your going to be practicing REAL EMT skills then you better be certified and be in compliance with all laws and regulations.

Failure to meet the legal requirements can result in severe legal consequences, including jail time.

Sorry, but you seem fishy to me.
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If you are so knowledgeable on this topic, can you provide me with citation pertinent to New York State from a reputable source (e.g. public health law, case law, DOH document)?
 
SeanMalone said:
So lets say that a facility has its own AED, first aid kit, and resuscitation equipment.... an EMT can use that to give care and be protected by good Samaritan style laws in NY. How is it any different if they have their own first aid kit (never mind the "drugs" for now) and use it on someone in the street?
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I am not a lawyer and you should seek legal advice from one in your area, but having disclaimed that.

I am under the impression that good sam only covers you if you have no duty to act.

If you are being contracted, paid or otherwise, and are expected to respond, that could potentially be a major game changer in terms of coverage.
 
Okay, this is really sounding fishy. As stated before, every state in the US requires anyone employed and on duty as an EMT regardless of level to be under medical direction. Can I state New York's specific statute on it? Not right now; but I'm certain you could find it. This is standard info taught to every EMT and it shows up on NREMT's exam. The fact that you're asking in the first place leads one to question whether or not you are an EMT.
Next, you keep asking for citations from statute, case law, etc. to back up what we have said. Like I said, EVERY ONE of us is taught the answer to your question in basic school. You use distinct legal terminology here, making me question that EMT certification further - these are not terms we would throw around when asking about this and no EMT I know of would even ask the question except once back in school. I suspect an ulterior motive here.
Finally, a bit of quick of google-fu turns up a Sean Malone working as a lawyer for the Kirkland and Ellis LLP law firm, which happens to be in New York. Interesting, considering your terminology, insistence of proof by case law, and the fact that your profile here is only one day old and all of your posts are in this thread.
I could be way off base, of course, but the s/sx suggest I am not.
 
Who cares?

gw812 said:
Okay, this is really sounding fishy. As stated before, every state in the US requires anyone employed and on duty as an EMT regardless of level to be under medical direction. Can I state New York's specific statute on it? Not right now; but I'm certain you could find it. This is standard info taught to every EMT and it shows up on NREMT's exam. The fact that you're asking in the first place leads one to question whether or not you are an EMT.
Next, you keep asking for citations from statute, case law, etc. to back up what we have said. Like I said, EVERY ONE of us is taught the answer to your question in basic school. You use distinct legal terminology here, making me question that EMT certification further - these are not terms we would throw around when asking about this and no EMT I know of would even ask the question except once back in school. I suspect an ulterior motive here.
Finally, a bit of quick of google-fu turns up a Sean Malone working as a lawyer for the Kirkland and Ellis LLP law firm, which happens to be in New York. Interesting, considering your terminology, insistence of proof by case law, and the fact that your profile here is only one day old and all of your posts are in this thread.
I could be way off base, of course, but the s/sx suggest I am not.
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Whether or not this person is an EMT, lawyer, 14 year old in his parent's basement?

It was a reasonable question.
 
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